Exploring the Power of Heart Coherence with Aveen Banich

Interview Episode with Aveen Banich

Aveen: [: 00:00:00

And so we know what that feels like. Many of us. I mean, if you're human, you know what? Feeling incoherent.

Laurin: Right.

Aveen: But what's beautiful about coherence is that we've all had moments of flow. And when we are in flow, On a physical level, our heart rate , syncs up with our breath, syncs up with our brain waves.

enough time for everything. [: 00:01:00

Laurin: Hello, friends. Welcome to Curiously Wise Practical Spirituality and Action. I'm Laurin Wittig, and I'm your host, and today I'm so grateful to have the wonderful Aveen Banich as my guest. But before we dive into another amazing conversation here on Curiously Wise, let me introduce you to Aveen. Aveen is a board certified ophthalmologist, a writer, a certified yoga teacher, and the host of the podcast, the Wholehearted Healer.

Avene blends her years of wisdom as a physician, intuitive being and transformational mentor to assist others in remembering their passion and purpose in life. Her favorite quote is from one of her teachers, Ramdas. We are each just walking each other home. Welcome, Aveen.

Aveen: Thank you so much for having me, Laurin. I'm happy to be here.

s. So today I get to ask the [: 00:02:00

Practice that you have. And those are not two things that I find that come together very often, or at least I don't hear about those people who are doing it. And so let's just start with your journey. How did you get from physician to physician and what you're doing now?

Aveen: Sure. I actually think a lot of physicians come to the practice of medicine with a healer's heart. And whether that gets fostered or not through training is, is something to discuss. But for me, I have always been a seeker. I would say even as a kid, , I was raised Catholic and I was very into the mystics.

inger growing up. I let that [: 00:03:00

And I married to a surgeon and it wasn't until we had four children and it wasn't until my fourth child was born that I really Recognized that the way I was living my life was not sustainable or healthy. And my youngest child was born prematurely in a crash c-section. I had just gone, I.

Been in clinic and I hadn't been feeling well, but I had been in clinic that morning and I had a routine OB appointment, and they checked his heartbeat. It was like less than 10. A normal baby's heartbeat is in the hundred and thirties, forties. And so that started this Crisis really, of which I had no control.

life, which was ridiculous. [: 00:04:00

We didn't have any idea why that happened, so it was great mystery of surrounding like the details of how he was born and why that happened. He was in and out of the hospital for about the first year and a half, but then as most preemies do, he started to thrive. And it really wasn't until he started to thrive that I kind of, the wheels fell off for me because I think as mothers, we do that a lot.

We kind of hold it together when we need to.

Laurin: Yep.

Aveen: I just remember just being plagued by like questions of how did this happen? Why did this happen? And he was in and outta the hospital, so there were a lot of days when like we'd have to, I'd have to cancel clinic because he'd get sick. But I was just tenacious in thinking that I could, just, the way I described it as like plate spinning, like I could just keep on working and keep on having a surgical practice and raise my children and that nothing had to change.

time to rest, it's time to. [: 00:05:00

That hospitalized me that required major surgery. And I remember I was recovering in our bedroom and I was planning like to just get back at it. I was like a weeble, you know, like just how many times could I get knocked down? And my husband sat on the bed and said, do you need to be struck by lightning to like step back and slow down? And

Laurin: That's a good man.

Aveen: yeah. It was interesting though because when I talk about it now, it sounds ridiculous how tenacious, and it was a lot of my life was wrapped up in that role of position and I felt like if I step back, it was like an ego death or

Laurin: Mm-hmm.

Aveen: And so what's really interesting in my story is that.

e I'm talking hours to days, [: 00:06:00

Like I didn't know what was happening to me at the time, but it was. I've now come to understand it's a little bit like when someone describes a near death experience, what happened to me? It was really dramatic and it really changed the trajectory of my life, how I see things, how I like I was shown that.

Just very fundamental things that when I started reading about the Christian mystics and about near death experiences, there's so much language for this that's just kind of under the surface that so many people experience, but not many people talk about,

Laurin: Mm-hmm.

Aveen: Like these concepts of just that love truly is kind of the fabric of the universe.

And I just, I just had this [: 00:07:00

So many of us seem to think we need to do right. You so many experiences of awakening, like after the death of a loved one or a divorce or a major illness. And I really think where we're moving in the future is to understanding that that's available to us without the suffering.

hey were determined to be on [: 00:08:00

And I was like, you, I had health problems. I had a child that I was afraid was gonna die for, for the first 25 years of his life. He's 30 now. But yeah, so in and out of doctors and managing medicine and it's so easy to focus on the child, the issue, you know? And, and I, I did not have the same kind of job you did, but I was in, in the IT business when I decided I had to step out because my children needed me.

You know, more than I could give them. And that's a, that's a business you can't step back into cuz it moves too fast, you know? So I knew that at the time. So it was the same kind of giving up my identity to do what you did, to like, okay, we gotta, we gotta take care of this child and make sure that, you know, they survive and thrive and,

ecially as physicians, we're [: 00:09:00

It's steps matter. But when we broaden that out to think that we need to like control our lives it's, it was such an uphill walk at that time in my life. I mean, it was a busy time anyway. I had young children. But at the same time, When we sort of surrendered to this idea that the universe has our back, and we may not always understand the way things are playing out, but if we can move in flow rather than thinking we have to drive the bus amazing doors open in, in directions that I never would have suspected, you know, 15 years ago.

And the life just gets more magical.

w because everything just is [: 00:10:00

Aveen: Well, and I think even before our kids are sick, I

Laurin: Oh yeah,

Aveen: I think we're really, we're awarded for being multitasking amazing women, right? The more we can, the more balls or plates we can juggle, the better people think we are. And so I think for me, I look back at you know, the birth of my youngest now.

As a gift. I mean, I'm so, you know, right as I was just, I was talking to somebody just the other day, like we were, we were so blessed that James survived. I mean, when he was in the nicu, there were lots of lots of parents who were going through the same thing as us whose children didn't survive. So I don't want to minimize, I mean, it was, I don't know what my perspective would've been if we had lost him.

the same area, but it might [: 00:11:00

And that I, I also think that they're available for everyone. Like I don't, you know, I think a lot of times when people hear you're an intuitive or a mystic or whatever you language you wanna put around it sometimes people feel like you're different or special or you know, that they couldn't possibly do that.

And if you had asked me when I was 35, I would've thought no. But I really think that that's, it's a part of the whole human experience, that it's just something we've forgotten. And I think that. So many are remembering, and I think a lot of kids are being born. Young people remember it seems easier than we do.

already, you know, doing it. [: 00:12:00

Aveen: Yeah.

Laurin: But they're, yeah, I absolutely agree. I think that the next generations are coming in a lot more awake, a lot more aware, a lot more remembering.

And and I was pretty stubborn about remembering. I was like, I don't wanna remember that stuff. Not consciously, but a lot of

Aveen: But it, what, what was really interesting to me is like after all of these experiences, I mean, I had so many different mystical experiences. I would sit down and be absorbed into experiences. It was all distilled into wake up and remember, so this is. This is wisdom that we inherently, I believe it's our birthright.

p me remember and vice versa.[: 00:13:00

Laurin: I had. I think that's why I love this format of just having these great, great conversations with people, frankly, from all around the world who I never would've known without Zoom. Thank you. Zoom. But I learned something I. About myself and about the world, about the universe. Every time I have a conversation with somebody.

And and that is part of my, my purpose is to get the voice out there so we can get the message out there so we can help each other remember, and and move into this beautiful place where we can live in joy and peace and love and all of those great things. So tell us a little bit about what you do now, that's not the ophthalmology.

Aveen: So from that time, I, I was really looking to understand what was happening to me. My husband always jokes that, like I was explaining things that were written in ancient yogic texts that I didn't know what the name was. So I have a Christian background, so I started studying the Christian mystics.

of mysticism especially of, [: 00:14:00

I started to lead retreats. I started to do kind of mentoring sessions for individuals. I love the idea of collaboration and circle, and so I, I offer a couple of circles twice a year, just for that sense of connection, collaboration, and, and sort of remembering as a group.

Laurin: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Aveen: that's kind of what I do these days.

what's in my toolkit to, to [: 00:15:00

Laurin: Yeah. Yeah. I love that. Yeah, it's, I, I've done, you know, I'm just curious. It's like every time I hear about a new modality, it's like, oh, I wanna learn about that. Oh, I wanna try that. You know, it's like, and I did decide, it's interesting because I decided a couple of years ago that, that I was really taking courses to remember what I already knew.

Aveen: Mm-hmm.

Laurin: It's like I need to be reminded cuz I had been told in meditation and I, I communicate with my guides pretty regularly that I had been a healer in many lifetimes. I had been a shaman in many lifetimes and that I knew all this stuff. I carried it with me from life to life, but I didn't remember it. And and it, so it's interesting cuz I hadn't thought about it in that frame that we are all just remembering.

I just was thinking, I have to remember. But

ear of his life, I would not [: 00:16:00

Intuitive guidance, we are not the ones healing. I really feel that we just get into alignment enough to create a state where others can come into alignment and remember themselves. And so that's, that's been a really kind of beautiful arc. In that, yes, there's tons of modalities and tools, but at the end of the day, I think all of them just help us find coherence.

Laurin: Okay, so can you define coherence for me?

t right now. So there's been [: 00:17:00

We've really grown up in a very brain centric society where we think, I think therefore I am. But what's really amazing is they're finding that the heart can beaten a certain way when we are in a relaxed state, relaxed heart, open mind that. The heart becomes almost like the conductor of the symphony and the heart sends more information to the brain than the brain sends to the heart, which when I first heard that as a physician, I was floored.

g. Right. Or this, just this [: 00:18:00

And we, we still want our brain, so we want a grounded logic, but we want to lean into the heart. And what's beautiful about heart coherence is that it's pretty easy to teach about, because many of us today know what it's like to live in an incoherent state because we're there a lot, right? So when we're incoherent I'm stressed out.

I feel scattered. My memory feels bad. Like I'm, I'm reaching that perimenopausal age and sometimes I wonder, oh my gosh, am I getting dementia? Our immunity is not as good. We, the other really interesting thing about incoherent states is that we feel a couple of things. We feel like there's never enough time, like we're so hyper-focused on time and how there's not enough of it.

Laurin: Mm-hmm.

ding, right? Because they're [: 00:19:00

And so being in an incoherent state, I believe that like, until we are elevated beings like Christ or Buddha, we are given a certain amount of energy a day. And when we're incoherent, we waste, we squander a lot of that energy. I, I see it as like a ping pong ball going all in all directions. And it leads to burnout, depression, all those things.

And so we know what that feels like. Many of us. I mean, if you're human, you know what? Feeling incoherent.

Laurin: Right.

Aveen: But what's beautiful about coherence is that we've all had moments of flow. And when we are in flow, On a physical level, our heart rate , syncs up with our breath, syncs up with our brain waves.

like there's enough time for [: 00:20:00

Laurin: Exactly.

Aveen: And we also then begin to, and some people may call it their gut, but we start to trust in our own knowing. We can hear our guides, we can hear like the way opens in a way that we may not have step by step, but we kind of trust that we're being guided and we don't have to. I mean, I think it's great to talk to your spouse and your girlfriends and.

About your next step, but we all remember like being in sixth grade trying to decide like, should I date this boy or girl or should I not? And kind of just letting other people decide for us, you know? And so it's, and in that coherent state our health gets better. I mean, that's what's interesting.

g. Our digestion gets better.[: 00:21:00

Laurin: Mm-hmm.

Aveen: For me, it was my grandmother growing up. You know, she was she had a presence and I think coherence. To me. The other word I would say is someone who has presence. Like she had tons of grandchildren, but when I was in her presence, she saw me and I felt. I felt better. So what's really amazing too is there's all these videos on YouTube of a bunch of cuckoo clocks and the, this is why I teach this to teachers, because imagine a teacher in a third grade class, she's coming in in the morning, she's had a terrible night's sleep.

r who feels very rested, who [: 00:22:00

Laurin: Mm-hmm.

Aveen: Her being in coherence impacts every child in that room the same as you.

Being in coherence affects your. The people living in your home, the pets living in your home, you being in coherence affects when you go to the grocery store. Your an, your interaction with the person checking you out, the people in line. So it's really, it's such a useful use of our energy and it is really a way to transform the world.

I think it's the only way

Laurin: Yeah.

Aveen: and and it takes some, it's, it's countercultural in that it requires Intention. It, it requires some practice. It's something that HeartMath Institute can show you. You know, there's tons of YouTube videos on it, but you can get better at being in heart coherence and and so I find it really exciting.

stical, cuz I don't know how [: 00:23:00

Laurin: Right?

Aveen: of peace. And even meditation. I mean, some people meditation feels very natural to me now. But I understand that if, you know, you have a a thousand things going on, that meditation might be feel out of grasp for you.

Laurin: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. It's. I, I think that, I think I said this to you before we got on here, that for me, I can't keep track of time anymore. I mean, I, I have reminders on my phone, reminders on my calendars, you know, so I don't, I don't miss something important, but I literally, this week on, I. What I discovered was Monday.

eart centered so easily. Now.[: 00:24:00

I know I was already working on it, but I feel like that that pause in life allowed sort of all these things I had been soaking in and, and learning and practicing to just kind of settle. Because I do, I do, I feel like I just walk around with just my heart kind of always, you know, just like spreading this lovely heart energy.

And I don't have to do it so consciously anymore. And I love your comment about the the grocery store line because one of my favorite things to do, and one of the ways I practice this was you get in a grocery store line, people are grumpy. It's the end of the day, they gotta go home and make dinner, and the kids are, you know, blah, blah, blah.

cash register and you know, [: 00:25:00

I was really, you know, really impressed by how you, you kept your cool, you know, it's like, and they light up, you know, and then, That trickles down the line, you know, and everybody who comes into that person, that checkup person's energy now is lifted up a little bit. It's one of my very favorite things to do,

Aveen: Yeah, and I mean, I don't mean, I don't mean to sound like I'm always in hard coherence. What I, what I find good about this practice is that we all, I think it's human to get, I mean, I'm not sure we're supposed to be in hard coherence. There's a time to be stressed out and to, you know, if you're, you're driving and you almost get in an accident or so.

lly, right. Until eventually [: 00:26:00

Laurin: right, right. And it, it, I mean, I, I, I refer to it as practice because I had to learn to consciously realize I was feeling this stress, energy and soaking it in because I'm looking at my watch. I can't believe it's taking so long. You know, make a choice to change, take a breath, and then just take advantage of whatever I could do to lift the people around me.

And sometimes it's just being the peaceful one in line,

Aveen: Mm-hmm.

Laurin: but sometimes you can smile at somebody or you can, you know, compliment them on something they've done and, and it just lifts everybody, makes every, you know, it ripples out. So,

o school and daycare and get [: 00:27:00

There was no pausing. In fact, pausing felt dangerous to me. I write about that because, you know, you, you feel like, well, if I, if I slow down to really take stock, I might just have to burn this whole, like, blow it all up. And that feels, you know, you're like, I don't have time for that.

Laurin: Yeah.

Aveen: I gotta do all these things today.

Right? And so we kind of just ignore it. And for me, and I think a lot of women it, it came out as health issues, right? I, on the surface, in my conscious mind, I'm like, I am doing it. I am holding it all together. And then I would get like a facial cellulitis and need like a, an emergency tooth ab, you know, pulled, or I'd get really sick one night and almost die from ascending cholangitis all the while being like, I've got this.

n hour. So for me, the first [: 00:28:00

The space between no longer and not yet where time expands. Time only exists in the third and fourth dimension if we're existing or resonating in the fifth dimension. Which sounds a little trippy in quantum physics at the moment, but that's when there's enough time for everything and we start to notice the beauty around us and the beauty in our children rather than, you know, me being annoyed at my teenager's room right now.

And so we dip into that space when we allow ourselves to pause. And I think if, if we can consciously approach this, then we may not have to blow up our lives like you and I had to do for a while. You know what I mean? I stepped outta medicine completely for a number of years, and eventually I stepped back in because I feel I really feel from an a, like a, A state of coherence, a state where you're aware that love is the center of everything.

n bring that to anything you [: 00:29:00

Laurin: Right. Yeah, I, I totally agree with that, and I, I think it's, it's. Part of why so many people are, I call it coming online now, who are, you know, are remembering and they're, they're waking up and they're, they're moving down a path where they are working with the flow, where they are go moving with the flow, the heart's opening.

to live from that place of, [: 00:30:00

So even if you don't know that you've gotten there yet, but you have, every time you walk through someplace, you're, you're sh you're sharing that vibration, that frequency. And it's just, it's, yeah. I get excited when I get a, amidst a group of people who are aware of that, their hard energy, cuz it's like, it's like it's a high, you know, it's just, it just feels so good.

Aveen: It does. And then, you know, it's, I had a vision once and I ex, I was in a, a very beautiful group, a three year group. It was called Spiritual Transfer. Spiritual deepening for global transformation at the Christine Center in Willard, Wisconsin, where the same circle of about 30 people met every few months for three years.

ind of was in, I call it the [: 00:31:00

I knew that they were connected to me. Not all of them, some of them more than others, but they were also reflective of light. And so when I described this, there was a Jungian analyst in the group and she said, that sounds a lot like Indra's net, Indra's Web, which was this ancient Hindu description of the universe and this idea that we are mirrors for one another.

in me that sometimes it's my [: 00:32:00

I don't even know, right? I read the right book, falls in my hands, I meet the right person, I have the right conversation. But that, none of it's an accident, right? So this, for me, it's this deep understanding that the universe is benevolent, that love is really the energy that if it's not love, we've simply forgotten.

And that, you know, we'll, we'll awaken to it eventually, and that we are to be that for one another because, Right un until I'm or you are right at that Christ did stage where you can hold that resonance. We need each other to help remind us. I mean, I think that's, I, I kind of view being alive as being in school and I think that's the curriculum, like loving someone else enough to help them back into resonance and not just ignoring and not just pretending they don't exist or getting angry.

ow. And I, and as the system [: 00:33:00

Laurin: Right. Oh yeah, absolutely.

Aveen: we will remember and will, enough of us will stay in that resonance so that it will kind of help everyone remember.

Laurin: Yes. Yeah. Yeah. And, and I, I do believe that we will get there. I am in that resonance far more often than I used to be. You know, and every year it gets, it gets easier and easier and I'm, and I'm able to do it with less and less conscious. You know, I need to let me ta tap into my heart and take a breath at the ground.

f up energetically and then, [: 00:34:00

It's like, why can't I just hold it? And they're like, well, you need the contrast so that you recognize when you have lifted up and when you have fallen out of that space that you now would rather live in. And that contrast brings your attention to it so that you can consciously make a choice about it.

And it was like, okay, I still didn't like this idea of contrast. I just wanna live up there. But I have less and less contrast. But boy, when I, when I experience that, it's immediate, I immediately know, oops, I have slipped out of. The sweet spot and I can get back much faster that way. So there is that, that, that falling out of it, forgetting and then remembering again.

ll out your tools, you know, [: 00:35:00

Aveen: Yeah. And, and I also, I, I really am a believer in grounded spirituality. Like it's, for me, it's, I can hang out in that beautiful field or the, or space as I call it, like in meditation

Laurin: Mm-hmm. Oh, yeah.

Aveen: said, like, if you think you're enlightened, go spend a week with your family. Right? So it's how can I bring this into the practical being?

Human right. So that when I'm in a busy clinic or what when I am running late with my children in the morning or something doesn't go my way or so for it, it really is also how like a practical

Laurin: Yep.

Aveen: spirituality and how can I how can I be in coherence when. Geez, the universe is testing me

Laurin: Yes.

Aveen: to fall out of it, and, and so maybe, you know, I fall out of it instead of a year for a week or two, and then I'm like, whoa, whoa, whoa, let's get back,

Laurin: Right, [: 00:36:00

And it's, so, it's, yeah, I don't need that as much. Let's, let's take just a minute or two here cuz we're just about to the end of our time, but To talk about circles because I, back in 2018, couple years before the pandemic, I founded what I called the Wise Women's Circle. And I had, gosh, I think I had close to 40 people on the mailing list by the time we stopped for the pandemic.

it was such a transformative [: 00:37:00

So, Talk a little bit about your experience, cuz you run circles, right? So talk a little bit about why you do that and, and what you see. What, what value are you finding in there?

y women, we feel like in our [: 00:38:00

And doing the finances and keeping the house clean and getting the kids where they need to go and just kind of running the ship. So I think first and foremost just this idea of coming into circle is an ancient idea. I think women have been doing it. For as long as they have been on the earth. I think there's something very comforting about being in circle.

ld in logrhythmically bigger [: 00:39:00

I mean, Christ said, you know, like when two or more are gathered, right? And so I think that idea of be people in coherence supporting one another, learning from one another, helping, helping someone else remember just by sharing their story or it's not, you know, It's not stuffing wisdom down anyone's throat.

It's just like, wow, that's you too. You have that problem too. I thought I was the only one. And that's really the most amazing. So I, you know, I help facilitate a circle. I don't lead it, right? I don't think there's any real leader of a circle. You want someone to guide. You know, just how the flow works. But I think the magic really comes from just trusting that this really unique group of people are gonna gather and coherence and love, and the universe will sort of take it from there.

of gathering is just the key.[: 00:40:00

Laurin: Yeah. Yeah. The, the one thing I learned, or the, not the one thing, but the thing I learned pretty early with my circle was that everybody always left that circle feeling better than when they got there. I mean you could see people's faces change as the conversation took place and it. We just learned so much from each other that we were not alone in the path that we were on.

And I had had that experience with a circle at in college that was not just girls, but it was for the kids of, with parents who had, who were alcoholics. And and that was my first experience with the, the huge benefit of community and learning that I was not alone in my experience with having an alcoholic parent.

claim it as my own and see, [: 00:41:00

Some people had more wisdom than others about things, you know, and they would share that. And and everybody felt. Stronger, happier, just more, I think, more coherent, less chaotic, more coherent when they left that circle.

Aveen: Yeah, I mean, I think healing, I think the future is collaborative and connected. I mean, Dalai Lama, I believe it was the Dalai Lama, said like the next Buddha is the Songa, right? Meaning like the, the next, you know, Songa is like a circle, right? So that really it's less about me. It's more about us.

time soon. I don't know when [: 00:42:00

Aveen: There you go.

Laurin: So I've been asking everybody this one question that I'm interviewing this year, and that is, do you have a must-read book that you would like to share with us?

Aveen: So many books. There are two books that I read. At least once a year, and I have for a number of years. The first is Mans Search For Meaning by Victor Frankl. I think that book, you know, in that book Victor Frankl was a physician in a concentration camp on the Holocaust. Kind of amazed at the potential and possibility for humans.

times as a gift is this book [: 00:43:00

KK to me is I'm very heart-centered and Kuan is the is in Buddhist temple. She sits sort of at the back of the altar, supposedly whispering to the Buddha at F. So she is, to me this really beautiful embodiment of strength and divine feminine. And I just love, the book almost reads like a fairytale.

It's a short book and it's, I just, I get something new every time I read it out of it. Yeah.

Laurin: Nobody's recommended those yet either. So something new for the list. Great. I haven't read either one of those, so I'm, I'm G I've got like a To Be Read pile now. You know, like it's just, it's gonna topple over except most of it's in my Kindle, so that helps.

Aveen: There you go.

Laurin: know. All right. So let's tell the listeners where they can find you.

just have conversations with [: 00:44:00

I offer one-on-one, you know, mentorship. I have some socials. Maybe we can link those in the show notes. But yeah, you can find,

ey that we're on, and I will [: 00:45:00

Aveen: Thank you so much for having me, Laurin.

Laurin: Thank you so much for joining us today on Curiously Wise If you enjoyed this episode, Please be sure to subscribe. So you don't miss future fabulous conversations. And if you had any ahas, please share them in a review on apple podcasts so we can continue to pay forward the unique wisdom we all have. If you want to know more about me or my intuitive energy healing practice Heartlight wellness.

Please head over to my website. www.heartlightjoy.com. Curiously Wise is a team effort. I am grateful for the skill and enthusiasm. Arlene Membrot our producer and Sam Wittig. Our audio engineer bring to this collaboration. Our music is where the light is by lemon music studio.

I'm Laurin [: 00:46:00